Reflections and Questions about the Seymour Era

codfanglers

codfanglers

Dedicated Member
I am writing this post alongside WSTOL's topics about specific episodes. This week Foggy returned and I said good bye to Seymour as my station aired Three Men and a Mangle. Now that Seymour's reign has passed, I saved a few reflective thoughts and questions.

1. Seymour is known as a pretentious, former headmaster. However, for the first few episodes of Series 9 he was more of an eccentric but friendly scientist and inventor. I really enjoyed his earlier role in the first few episodes of Series 9. By the end of Series 9 he was drastically different. Then he became the snobby type to wanted to have others think Clegg and Compo were his subordinates. Characters often change from the beginning, but my question is, why did Clarke change Seymour so much in one season? Was is so more scripts could be written around him?

2. I recently read the posts in the thread "Brian Wilde". I leive it was Big Unc that read from Vine's book and found that Wilde at one point wanted to move on to try more acting opportunities. Was this after Wilde's first run as Foggy or after his second? I believe it must have been after his first because I believe he was too ill to carry on when Thornton came in. I also read that his other ventures weren't so successful. So does that mean Wilde moved on at one point but after some failures he decided to rejoin Summer Wine?

3. I believe Three Men and a Mangle brought the introduction to Cooper and Walsh. When watching the episode I didn't even realize the officers were meant to be Cooper and Walsh until after the read Kitson and Emerick in the credits. They looked incredibly different!!!!! My question is were these guys a comic duo before Summer wine? If so, were they a Roy Clarke creation?Sort of like Howard, Pearl, and Marina were a trio before their time of Summer Wine. I ask this because now in this forum I am learning that they are still performing together.

4. In reading this forum I learned there are two things that don't get much praise in this forum. Edie and the show Keeping Up Appearances. However, I love both. It was a while back that I discovered the character Hyacinth Bucket was influenced by Edie. Recently I enjoyed discovering more connections between the two during season's 10 and 11. This was especially since, at the start, Ladies Coffee time was run by Edie. I enjoyed seeing her entertain so much during these moments. No questions here, just an observation. I will say this...for those of you here that aren't crazy about edie or Thora Hird, you have to at least give her credit for starting the tradition of ladies coffee time. As I mentioned before in this forums, I sometimes enjoyed the ladies as much as the guys, reminding me of my beloved, late grandmother.
 
Well Codfanglers old mate I must have given you the wrong impression there. I like the whole Edie and Wesley thing and the addition of Seymour sort of turns the Mrs Bucket thing sideways Wesley is still the henpecked Richard but he escapes to his shed, Edie is Mrs Bucket and Seymour is Emmet! The comedy scene has always had the "superior "person trying to lord it over the "peasents" and being brought down a peg or two.This rings true from Mickey Mouse onwards..I like most of Summer Wine and that bit with Edies voiceover is one of the funny moments. IMO ;)
 
dick said:
Well Codfanglers old mate I must have given you the wrong impression there. I like the whole Edie and Wesley thing and the addition of Seymour sort of turns the Mrs Bucket thing sideways Wesley is still the henpecked Richard but he escapes to his shed, Edie is Mrs Bucket and Seymour is Emmet! The comedy scene has always had the "superior "person trying to lord it over the "peasents" and being brought down a peg or two.This rings true from Mickey Mouse onwards..I like most of Summer Wine and that bit with Edies voiceover is one of the funny moments. IMO ;)
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Alright, I guess I did misinterpret you,Dick. I think of "set off" as "turned off". I get it now. Also, from previous conversations in this forum, I gathered this sense that Edie isn't liked all that much overall. I do know, however, that everyone loves Wesley, including myself. The only thing I don't get, in which I previously mentioned, is why in the credits they always have to write "special guest appearance by" Thora Hird.
 
dick said:
Well Codfanglers old mate I must have given you the wrong impression there. I like the whole Edie and Wesley thing and the addition of Seymour sort of turns the Mrs Bucket thing sideways Wesley is still the henpecked Richard but he escapes to his shed, Edie is Mrs Bucket and Seymour is Emmet! The comedy scene has always had the "superior "person trying to lord it over the "peasents" and being brought down a peg or two.This rings true from Mickey Mouse onwards..I like most of Summer Wine and that bit with Edies voiceover is one of the funny moments. IMO ;)
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Have to agree with Dick on this one,When ever Edie shouted down the lane to Wesley was always funny particually whwn she changes her tone"Wesley get your self in here".The look on Wesleys face when Edie praises Seymour is a picture i have always liked the seymour era. :)
 
[previously mentioned, is why in the credits they always have to write "special guest appearance by" Thora Hird.
[/quote]


I think it was because Thora was such a big star and she was only going do a couple of episodes but she was so popular that they kept her in and has a thank you she kept the title Special guest has did Jean Alexander.
 
codfanglers said:
1. Seymour is known as a pretentious, former headmaster. However, for the first few episodes of Series 9 he was more of an eccentric but friendly scientist and inventor. I really enjoyed his earlier role in the first few episodes of Series 9. By the end of Series 9 he was drastically different. Then he became the snobby type to wanted to have others think Clegg and Compo were his subordinates. Characters often change from the beginning, but my question is, why did Clarke change Seymour so much in one season? Was is so more scripts could be written around him?
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Series #9 was written in a rush. It started out as a six episode series but it was then decided to work to get Seymour well known to the audience and another six episodes were commissioned. (This is where the DVD con of calling series #9 two series originated).Then the whole twelve episodes were shot in 1986 together with the Special "Merry Christmas, Father Christmas". I assume Seymour evolved in Roy Clarke's imagination over the short period.

codfanglers said:
2. I recently read the posts in the thread "Brian Wilde". I leive it was Big Unc that read from Vine's book and found that Wilde at one point wanted to move on to try more acting opportunities. Was this after Wilde's first run as Foggy or after his second? I believe it must have been after his first because I believe he was too ill to carry on when Thornton came in. I also read that his other ventures weren't so successful. So does that mean Wilde moved on at one point but after some failures he decided to rejoin Summer Wine?
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That is all substantially correct. Wilde quit first time, partially out of hubris, with the excuse he wanted more variety. Then he left second time because of ill health.

codfanglers said:
3. I believe Three Men and a Mangle brought the introduction to Cooper and Walsh. When watching the episode I didn't even realize the officers were meant to be Cooper and Walsh until after the read Kitson and Emerick in the credits. They looked incredibly different!!!!! My question is were these guys a comic duo before Summer wine? If so, were they a Roy Clarke creation?Sort of like Howard, Pearl, and Marina were a trio before their time of Summer Wine. I ask this because now in this forum I am learning that they are still performing together.
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First, Cooper and Walsh were never named until "their" episode in Series #29 in 2008, "A Short Introduction To Cooper's Rules". Prior to that they were always referred to as "1st Policeman" and "2nd Policeman." I certainly do not think they were a comic duo before "Summer Wine", mainly because they were not the first police pair. That was essentially Kitson and Tony Capstick.
Kitson showed first as "Police Constable" in "Getting Sam Home"
Capstick was next as "Policeman" in "Big Day at Dream Acres"
Then Kitson and Emerick did "Downhill Racer", Series #10, and "Three Men and a Mangle", Series #11 as "PC #1" and "PC #2".
From becoming semi-regulars in Series #12, "That's Not Captain Zero" until the death of Capstick in 2004, the duo was played by Kitson and Capstick who for a while interchanged as "PC#1", PC#2" or simply "Policeman".
 
Thanks for the answers, Big Unc. It was like the old days in the expired forum where you answered so many people's questions. Your series 9 info is quite interesting and since I don't get the specials, I missed some of Kitson and Emerick's first appearances. I recently missed Downhill Racer as well (I don't have a good recording system). However, I still can't believe how different they looked back then!

Also, to Susan, I heard before that they used "Special Guest Appearance" for Thora Hird, but the info that she only planned to be in a few episodes was news to me! Since Michael Aldridge was also a big name to enter Summer Wine, did he and Hird have a previous working relationship? I am wandering this considering they entered Summer Wine around the same time.
 
If you 'don't get the specials' you may not have seen Uncle of the Bride made a year before series 9 which introduced us to both Seymour and Edie.

I think Uncle of the Bride shows all the characteristics of Seymour which you noticed in series 9, but obviously any actor and any writer will take a bit of time to develop his characters.

Apparently Michael Aldridge did struggle in maintaining one accent in the series - yet I never really noticed.
 
wstol said:
If you 'don't get the specials' you may not have seen Uncle of the Bride made a year before series 9 which introduced us to both Seymour and Edie.

I think Uncle of the Bride shows all the characteristics of Seymour which you noticed in series 9, but obviously any actor and any writer will take a bit of time to develop his characters.

Apparently Michael Aldridge did struggle in maintaining one accent in the series - yet I never really noticed.
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Thanks for the info. I forgot all about Uncle of the Bride, but of course I never saw it. I know I can catch the specials on you tube, but I am so accustomed to watching Summer Wine on TV, that it just wouldn't be the same on computer.

I never really noticed the accent change, but that could go automatically with the character change.
 
What accent change? I thought that was his true accent. Where did Michael
Aldridge originally come from?
 
Rhi said:
No problem. I think I read somewhere he was from Glastonbury. Pretty area, that.
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He was certainly a southerner, born in Glastonbury, Somerset, down in the West Country with its own broad accent. But he was, certainly in secondary school days, at Gresham's School, Norfolk, probably as a boarder. Norflok has its own broad accent but he probably, as a school boarder, did not mix much with the local population. In LOTSW I seem to recall a very neutral accent from him.
 
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