Toms Abode

Barrychuckle

Barrychuckle

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I'm slightly confused (doesn't take much!) about the later episodes featuring Tom, I assumed he lived in the wooden shed which he used to occupy next to the allotment. Not sure why I thought this perhaps it's because there was a hammock in there which I thought was his bed.

From what I recall there isn't too much mention (if any) of him a vegetable patch he tends, not sure if anyone else thought the lived in this shed? But if not I'm guessing we never knew where he lived after he moved out of Compos old house.
 
When Mrs A threw him out - out of what was the home they apparently rented from the council, that just happened to have been rented by Compo before - he went to live with Smiler ... then practically the only time we see him when not at Aunties, he is in his shed!
 
I get the feeling that Roy really didn't know what to do with Tom's character after a few series.
Obviously he was pivotal to those episodes after Bill's death and was used brilliantly.
He came with baggage, a clapped out van, Mrs. Avery and the dreadful Babs who served their purpose and were outed quite quickly.
Mrs. Avery was part of the transition process and the establishment of Tom as a main character and was written out when she'd served her purpose (in my humble opinion possibly a few episodes too late).
After that, Tom was almost a spare part, he'd been established as the 5th member of what should've been the main 3, as an actor (again in my view) he didn't progress and neither did the writing for his character.
I think Roy was landed with him, as also he was with other bit part characters and at certain times in later series, there were more extras than Ben Hur.
In the early/middle days every episode revolved around 7, maybe 8 characters including the trio, cafe and whichever oddball was introduced. By the end, there were often 12-15+ characters that all needed some role.
Tom was one that 'COULD' have been phased out at some point, but given his part in the post-Compo transition, it was difficult.
I always felt in later days that the series was carrying 2 or 3 characters too many.
 
I might have said this before - I've written so much about the show I'm almost convinced it's real - but Tom and Mrs A could have easily have gone off in the bus, unexpectedly, not to be seen for a couple of series and it would have been entirely in character. They could return just as suddenly, at exactly the right moment for them to be useful to the plot, then disappear again...
 
Inky Batty said:
I get the feeling that Roy really didn't know what to do with Tom's character after a few series.
Obviously he was pivotal to those episodes after Bill's death and was used brilliantly.
He came with baggage, a clapped out van, Mrs. Avery and the dreadful Babs who served their purpose and were outed quite quickly.
Mrs. Avery was part of the transition process and the establishment of Tom as a main character and was written out when she'd served her purpose (in my humble opinion possibly a few episodes too late).
After that, Tom was almost a spare part, he'd been established as the 5th member of what should've been the main 3, as an actor (again in my view) he didn't progress and neither did the writing for his character.
I think Roy was landed with him, as also he was with other bit part characters and at certain times in later series, there were more extras than Ben Hur.
In the early/middle days every episode revolved around 7, maybe 8 characters including the trio, cafe and whichever oddball was introduced. By the end, there were often 12-15+ characters that all needed some role.
Tom was one that 'COULD' have been phased out at some point, but given his part in the post-Compo transition, it was difficult.
I always felt in later days that the series was carrying 2 or 3 characters too many.
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I completely concur with everything you said above, it was almost as though Roy Clarke was told he had to shoehorn Tom into the later episodes. Nothing against the actor, but I think Tom would have had more impact if he'd just come back after Compos death and then was written out a few series after. I felt he added nothing to the later episodes and him and Smiler were a very odd coupling....
 
Barrychuckle said:
I completely concur with everything you said above, it was almost as though Roy Clarke was told he had to shoehorn Tom into the later episodes. Nothing against the actor, but I think Tom would have had more impact if he'd just come back after Compos death and then was written out a few series after. I felt he added nothing to the later episodes and him and Smiler were a very odd coupling....
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Yep, that's it for me mate.
Nelly was also a character we didn't need either.
I liked Ros, she was the counterbalance to the battleaxes, but when Dora sadly left, there were other options for a companion for Pearl.
Miss Davenport and Nelly both in episodes was one character too many.
Glenda could've filled the Nelly role and with some creative writing, Glenda could've filled the 'companion' role to Marina too.
Obviously the Compo and Nora's house and steps were iconic locations, so we needed an idiot and a battleaxe there, so Stella coming in to replace Nora was acceptable and needed, but again, Stella could've provided 'cover' for a couple of characters.
For me, Nelly, Tom and Miss Davenport could all have either been used way more sparingly or phased out over a few series.
 
It's only my view obviously and I'm not a genius like Roy Clarke, but the Library was a redundant location for quite a few series.
The 'Howard changing his library book to meet Marina' was done, which phases out Miss Davenport.
Had the series gone on for another series or more I would've had Stella and Alvin possibly taking over the Cafe, which was a much needed location and they could've reprised the Sid and Ivy old school input.
But obviously when Roy wrote the last series or two, he didn't actually know when the end was going to come.
As I said, I'm not a scriptwriting genius that wrote masterpieces in comedy, but I would've done a few things differently.
 
It was really interesting when Tommy Cannon was asked at the 50th Event if they’d have joined the cast permanently if they were asked. Tommy said without hesitation they would have, not sure about Tommy but Bobby Ball I feel could have a perfect addition. I can imagine him as the Alvin character only funnier.
 
The introduction of Nelly and the incessant mentions of Travis were something we could've survived without I think.
I have no issue at all with June Whitfield being in the show, she was a legend and ideal, but her one off wife of a barmpot was enough.
IF, she was to be carried on, then have Potts in it too as Warren Mitchell was also perfect for the series. Have them both in to take over the cafe.
Obviously poor old Jane was on her last legs for a couple of series, fresh blood in the cafe was what the series needed.
 
And if i was being brutally honest, Entwistle was a character that should've only been in for a few episodes/series and phased out too.
Barry could've done everything Entwistle did in the later days.
I liked Bert Kwouk, he was a welcome addition, but a barmpot for a few episodes was the extent of his character.
 
Entwistle never got much by way of character development. Basically one-liners in broken English for added effect. Sad for sure as he always seemed like a more positive and optimistic counterbalance. I'm still trying to figure out what the writing atop the truck bed meant.
 
My thoughts on some of the above...

Tom could never fill Compo's wellies - he never was intended to in my view - they tried to give some of his characteristics to him and also to Alvin and Billy but ultimately Bill Owen created such a truly unique character it still wasn't enough. There was occasionally the time early on when he had a nice story such as in Exercising Father's Bicycle or Getting Barry's Goat but in honesty as time wore on it felt as though the show was saying 'Bill's gone but his son's still in it so we're worth watching still!' The problem being he never had a permanent and consistent role to play. When he first landed in Holmfirth the possibilities seemed endless but eventually became another stooge for Aunty. Given his early portrayal was that of a man that lived off his wits and could as easily fleece you as charm you it seemed odd he would take up a menial position that would probably cost him money to do. His associate Mrs Avery gave Nora something to do temporarily but Bab's greatest gift to the series was her leaving it. Tom moving in with Smiler again opened up doors for the unlikelihood of Summer Wine Country's answer to the Odd Couple but alas that came to nothing.

Nelly was an interesting oddball that gave a different dynamic to the coffee mornings with her eccentricities but could have formed temporary alliances with the menfolk if it had suited them - instead she became a Bonnie to Pearl's Clyde which just didn't gel in the way it could have in the same way Roz managed to achieve. June Whitfield gave her usual excellent performance but had less and less to do that engaged us particularly on Hobbo's motherly strand.

Entwhistle was a replacement Wesley but given little of his depth. Having yet another unseen wife alongside Billy's was a bit too much as was his selling technique straight out of Aunties book. Towards the end of the show he is eventually being moulded into a new Clegg which works plot wise but no-one could do wistful sarcasm spliced with basic humanity in the same way as Peter Sallis.
 
I agree that the Nelly character never seemed fully formed or had enough to do which is pity as June Whitfield was arguably the most experienced female actor at the end. I've said this before and I know it's controversial but Tom was only ever a 'jobbing' actor who used to teach drama, I'm guessing due to lack of acting jobs. I just think he was upstaged by the talent around him who'd been at the top of their game for decades.
 
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